August 1996 Eczema Mailing List Archive

The response to my posting about the magnets was interesting. I really appreciate the feedback ie. get a good dermatologist. Our experience with skin disorders is very limited and we've only been dealing with this for the past 3 months. When Jaz's skin started to break in January we were told she had a bacterial infection and then later she was diagnosed with ringworm. So then it was off to the dermatologist for the first time. Aside from being cold and unapproachable the dr. gave us very little info. We were in his office for 5 minutes, he announced that she probably had psoriasis or possibly atopic dermatitis (I thought psoriasis was really bad dandruff) but he thought it was more likely to be psoriasis since it wasn't itchy. He sent us on our way with samples of cortisone creams and lotions and told us to come back next week. That was it!

That evening I searched through the internet on psoriasis and we were horrified to see photos of people with such disfigured skin. Our baby had psoriasis. I was beside myself. And I was so angry that this doctor had treated the whole thing so casually and he didn't mention any side effects to the cortisone. So much for informed consent.

We decided to get a second opinion. This doctor felt it was eczema and very unlikely to be psoriasis. Again very little info, just that it doesn't always itchy. Again cortisone ointments and lotions and this time I asked about the side effects. With great annoyance, he informed me that the only side effect of cortisone was that my daughters skin would get better. He said, " My job is to worry about the side effects. Your job is to go home and put this ointment on your daughters skin!" He had put me in my place, a place of ignorance and blind compliance, a place where he is the expert and I merely do as I am told.

I am looking for a third opinion, but the city I live in is fairly small and I don't have that many choices. I am very anxious to know whether the third opinion will be psoriasis or eczema (any thoughts on telling the difference, I think we asked this before). Somehow I am not feeling hopeful about what the medical profession has to offer (I do realize how well cortisone can work), and although I remain skeptical about some "alternative methods" I need to educate myself about skin disorders and not rely on any one model of care to dictate to me what I should do. Rather I would prefer to use the cortisone only when she really needs it (dr told me to apply generously) and to apply principles of nutrition, diet changes etc. and yes maybe even magnets. "First do no harm" is appropriate in this case and the FDA has approved these magnets and considers them safe. I'm not sure it will help, but it may have helped someone else so I'm willing to try it out. Anyway I guess I got a little carried away - didn't realize how much I'd written. Thanks for being there.

Robert, Sorry to hear about the callous treatment you've received from your local derm doctors. This is common, as we've discussed before. Caring providers ARE out there, but one must really seek them out. I've had much better attention and explanations about diseases, symptoms, and treatments from alternative providers than standard Western doctors, but I do know caring standard doctors exist too.

Since you have access to the WEB, Here's a good psoriasis site, complete with photos: http://www.tecc.co.uk/public/psoriasis/psor.html

Alicia, I also can scratch my legs and feel it in my spine etc. I think it's just the way the nerves are hooked up and also due to the fact that scratching changes the nerves over time. I also think that your queasy feeling may be related to the intense itch-scratch sensations. The body is so overwhelmed with itch-scratch that it signals the stomach to reject food. I tend to almost black-out after a heavy scratch session; I think this is a manifestation of the same phenomenon. 

To Jaz's Parents, I think you are taking the right approach: trying everything you can at once. This way, when improvement happens, then you can eliminate the one treatment that's the most trouble or has the worst side effects. If the skin is still good, eliminate one more... and so on. 

I'm sorry to hear that the derm doctors were so cold, but I have decided (after 50 yrs. of eczema) that even a nice derm doctor isn't going to get to the root of my problem. An allergist ( or a homeopath if you prefer alternative med.) is more likely to figure out the reason the skin problem is there in the first place. You DO need a dermatologist to get the skin under control and to tell you if it's eczema or psoraisis, but I recommend also seeing someone who's an expert on the immune system. 

Thanks for your reply, Aida. I'm sorry to learn that the two dermatologists you consulted were so insensitive. My own son, who is now seven, was basically "cured" at age two by a dermatologist who has known my family for years.

Our dermatologist is a very smart and compassionate older man. His wife is a psychiatrist and also a dermatologist, and they sometimes work as a team (though not in my son's case). I also was reluctant to use steroids on my son, as was the pediatrician who had been advising us up to that time.

What I have since learned is that many, even most cases of infantile eczema will disappear with time. The child can "outgrow" the condition. Perhaps in my son's case that would have happened anyway, but it was obvious that his two-week treatment with tar baths, topical steroids, and oral antibiotics was extremely effective, and probably brought my son out of his eczema cycle much more quickly than a less potent treatment alternative. Since my son has not had any steriods or other treatment for the past several years, there is no question of over-use of any medication in his case.

John, No, I wasn't kidding about retiring to a beach, I too have a good experiences while vacationing at the beach. Thanks for the feedback on Baby Magic. I'll give it a squeeze. Reading your e-mail, I think I wrote it (all the same symptoms). Oh yeah, those eye lids.They get it every couple of weeks. I've read that you should only apply .5% hydrocortison to eye lids due to the sensitivity of the skin. As far as other treatments I've tried (Antihistamines, steriods, Zonalon), they offer moments of fleeting hope but no cures. I prefer to use lotions only and not subject myself to the risks of drugs.

I have had the juicy little vesicles at times, but not recently. Don't know what makes them appear instead of dry patches.

Skin clearing on holidays/vacations brings us back to Alicia's point about chlorine in the water. Whenever she gets out of town to an area with unchlorinated water, her skin improves. I benefit from showering as little as possible (a bit hard here in the tropics) as our water here is heavily chlorinated. I also have stopped drinking the tap water and believe that it has helped.

Chlorine kills all the good bacteria in our poor overworked systems.

Yes, yes I believe it is true that the chlorinated water is the source of all my despair and sensitivity. As Sam and I have discussed before, chlorine kills the bacteria in the gut, and can lead to a candida outbreak internally - hyphae across the gut letting through macro molecules of food and therefore food allergies - , and a disruption in the pH balance on your skin externally. I know that my skin is definitely better on rainwater water, not cholrinated water, and even taking cold, not hot showers makes a big difference. Does anyone know of any studies looking into the effects of chlorinated water on the population? There must be some as putting chlorine in the water is a pretty major step.

I was also just talking to a woman I work with who gets asthma/eczema and she had been clear from eczema for about 5 years - since she moved out of town and started drinking and showering in bore or artesian water. She's just come back from a holiday down to southern Australia where her skin had broken out, as did her son's skin - which had never had eczema before in his life. Back at home and back onto bore water, they've both cleared up.

Again my sister has a house in B and a house in the country. She can stay in B for 4 weeks before her skin breaks out into eczema, she moves back the country - and onto tank water - and it takes anywhere from a week to 2 months to clear up.

I'm convinced but I just have to find a way to get to a place where I can either have tank water, or where the water is sufficiently unchlorinated for me to tolerate. I don't believe my eczema is just stress, I think it's candida and chlorinated water.

When we talk about eczema it seems to mean different things at different times and to different people. Perhaps something useful which this list could do would be to define what the term "eczema" really covers.

Also, we talk a lot about treatments (or palliatives) but less about causes or triggers. To violently allergic people the cause is fairly obvious, but to many of us it remains shrouded in mystery. Someone in today's postings put it down to candida and chlorine. Has anyone really been able to pin down what brings on an attack? If we could start to catalogue any triggers which consistently give rise to eczema we might be able to offer some evidence to people researching this area (I fervently hope that these beings actually exist!). This is a fairly large group communicating regularly and our pooled experience must surely offer some kind of insight to the medical community. 

I've been told not to use my normal hydrocortisone ointment on my eyelids as the skin is too sensitive. When I was in the US, my ophthalmologist there prescribed a special 'low-strength' ointment for the eyelids called Tobradex. It doesn't sting the eyes either.

Alicia, Have you considered trying a chlorine filter, or some other such step? It seems it might be worth the expense to test your (very interesting!) theory.

The fluid filled things I get are more like blisters (under the surface of the skin) than sacs - I.e. they don't hang or protrude. I can see them clearly only on my hands but I have actually felt and heard them popping (when I press) on my face during a real bad flare. When I scratch heavily on my lower legs, I later find salt-like stuff (dried fluid) there which I have termed "scratch crystals". I think the fluid is histamine (medical pros, please correct me if I'm wrong) 

Does anyone know of a scheme of catergorization for eczema? I think the two ideas (categories and triggers) are intimately related; presumably the people in different eczema categories would have different triggers.

Personally, I have eczema that is dry, scaly, and sometimes swollen. My triggers are either airborne allergens such as pollen, or contact with irritating substances on my hands. I tend to think the allergens are a "primary" cause, while the local irritation is probably secondary, in the sense that it just makes the underlying situation worse.

Some people might even have more than one kind of eczema...

I recently went to my derm who prescribed doxepin to relieve itching. I looked it up in the Physician's Desk Reference and it is primarily used as a psychotheraputic agent. I tried it once during the day and it made me extremely tired but I couldn't sleep. I kind of felt spacey too. These symptoms lasted for over 10 hours! However, it did relieve the itching. I'm not sure what the dosage was, but I only took one capsule. If I try it again, I will half the dose. Has anyone used this drug for relief of itching.

I've seen several references here lately to Benadryl. In New Zealand this is a cough medicine. Is it something different in other parts of the world? 

Pamela, Your doctor was wise to start you on a low potency (at least by my standards) steroid ointment. But don't hesitiate to ask for something stronger at least to get things under control. I find it necessary to use stronger stuff when dealing with such a large area.

In the USA Benadryl is an antihistamine, one of the old original ones I believe, diphenhydramine hydrochloride. What is the chemical name of the "Benadryl" used in NZ as a cough medicine?

From my own experience I have had everything, dry patches, red "angry" patches, oozing, fluid filled vesicles, peeling skin that makes my face look like a croissant...etc. you name it and I've had it. I would like to suggest a wonderful book I read recently called "SKIN DEEP" by Ted A. Grossbart and Carl Sherman...The 1992 edition is great..sorry I don't know if anyone else has read it recently..let me know!!

I've learned it's very important to apply creams that have no fragances or additive. The three recommended by my dermatologist are: Eucerin, Vanicream and Cetaphyl. It is essential to moisten the affected area with water before applying the cream. I just switched to Vanicream and I find it very soothing.

Re: topical steroids--I don't think you should ever apply to eyelids or any other thin-skinned area. The Dr. has warned that long term use of topical steroids will thin the skin. For the patches of dermatitus I sometimes get on my neck I use Westcort ointment, prescribed by my Dr. She won't allow me to use a strong Steroid on my neck--only my hands.

Antihistamines are a medication that block the inflammatory process, and thereby serve to bring relief to the itch.

Yes, that's exactly what I get... and know that when I was on the desensitisation treatment for dustmite my joints were just oozing yellowy fluid which I was told was histamine. I'd like to know what it is exactly though, - ie I think histamine is an amide...but am not sure, and why are the joints are particularily effected? Does internal histamine travel via the lymphatic system or by blood? When I do have bad eczema on my ankles and knees for instance, the glands in my groins go up, arms, wrists and the glands in my armpit go up. I think the glands are reacting to wounds in the skin in general but I still don't know about the joint stuff. I've asked doctors and they haven't really been able to explain much, and there's only about half a paragraph in my biochem book to explain it. So does anyone else out there have any answers?

Ralph - I have an expensive water purifier for my drinking water but am yet to get a filter for the shower head. Since I've reduced my showering - I used to shower twice a day, now it's once every 2 days- and shower using only cold water, my skin has cleared up a lot and has got a lot stronger. I also have fine blonde hair and noticed that the irritation on my face/neck often was following the length of my hair. At first I thought that it could be the shampoo that I used, stopped using it, changed brands, used only conditioner, tried just rinsing my hair etc.. etc.. but the irritation didn't clear up. (I went for 3 weeks without washing hair which I usually wash daily due to the fact that it greases up so quickly - a result of an effective ad campaign to addict consumers to detergents for their hair.) 

I think I am sensitive to something else in the atmosphere besides chlorine of course, but I believe it's chlorine that creates the sensitivity. Hot showers I find are soothing, but they do nothing for the condition of your skin. If as a baby I was fed on formala plus tap water, then I may have even developed an allergy to chlorine, besides the fact that it killed all the digestive bacteria in my gut, led to a candida outbreak and made me allergic in general. Yes, I believe chlorine is the anti-christ, and should not be added to the public's water supply.

Anyway to get back to your original question.....I would investigate the possiblity of getting a water filter for the shower head except that I'm probably about to move interstate and I believe that tank water is far better that filtered water. Maybe there are some great water filters out there, but I have more faith in tank, rain water.

I also just called my sister living in B and she's just broken out with eczema again after living there for the last 4 weeks. She's now pretty keen to move back the the country because she always clears up there - drinking and showering in rainwater. - She lived in the country for 4 years before going back to renovate her house - and she was totally clear of eczema.

Alicia, I think the skin over the joints is different because it has to stretch so much when the joint is moved, so maybe that's why you get more histamine there (I have not noticed this on myself). What I have noticed about joints is that I can really do scratch damage there because of the hard bone underneath - sort of like putting one's skin "between a rock and a hard place"? I don't know for sure, but I think that the histamine comes to the skin via the blood and that lymph nodes swell up in response to infection and/or inflammation. 

Yes probably. Maybe it's also that when the histamine is travelling through your body, looking for a suitable target site to inflame, and/or be excreted from, the joints - which also seem to lack a lot of dermal oil - are the easiest way out.

It's not really the bone that breaks the skin with me though, it's the little bubbles underneath the skin. When I scratch the bubbles burst, breaking the skin and the bubbles could be anywhere... lower arms, inner shins, behind my knees...

What's the feed back to the lymph nodes though, and what's the trigger for your bodies cortisones to start reducing inflammation? I think that's all via the lymphatics.

>>In the USA Benadryl is ... diphenhydramine hydrochloride<<

Well, well. Same old thing, but it also has ammonium chloride and sodium citrate. Never thought of taking a cough mixture for my eczema. 

Alicia, it sounds like this country area you are talking about is definitely the place we should all move. Where is it? Maybe we could establish an eczema colony (just kidding, smile, chuckle, emote, :-)

Seriously, it does sound great. My skin feels better just thinking about it. When can I go?

I have found some very interesting and useful information on the Web. Some of it is technical but one can glean quite a lot from it nevertheless. Do have a look. Some items are long (19 A4 pages) and are, perhaps, worth printing.

Social Hygiene Handbook - Eczema by Dr Y M Tang (Hong Kong) http://www.hkma.com.hk/std/eczema.htm

Atopic Dermatitus From a German University (Text- English) http://www.rrze.uni-erlangen.de/docs/FAU/fakultaet/med/kli/derma/vorlesun/atopie / atopisch.htm

For those on anti-depressives, Anafranil is often prescribed. A monograph on the drug can be found at: http://www.mentalhealth.com/drug/p30-a01.html

Food allergy http://www.gem.co.za/ALLSA/food_f.htm

Social Hygiene Handbook - Pruritus Dr Leung (a technical run-down on itching) http://www.hkma.com.hk/std/pruritus.htm

Social Hygiene Handbook - Principles of Prescribing Topical preparations and Topical Steroids (includes table of potency) http://www.hkma.com.hk/std/principl.htm

Somone in New Zealand was asking about Benadryl. It is both antihistamine and decongenstant. Read about it at length at: http://www.mentalhealth.com/drug/p30-b01.html

I have not noticed that Vit C. helps, but I haven't taken it often and then I had tried large doses.

What dose do you take per day and how do you space that out?

I have used doxepin topically, however, found the side affects (drowsiness, unclear thoughts) too distracting.

I often use vitamin C to alleviate my itching as well. I take a 500mg tablet in the morning or at night instead of antihistamine (antihistamine makes me feel like I'm on Mars).

A short while ago someone sent a post about the beneficial effects of an electric shaver. It didn't seem particularly useful at the time as the thought of shaving eczema was too horrible to contemplate. However, I suddenly remembered that I have a spot massager and, having a particularly stroppy patch of skin, gave it a going over with the massager. Well! - the result was just magic! It's scratching without damage - and the itching went away for quite some time (about 24 hours). Honestly, I don't have shares in a small electrical appliance company, but it does seem worth giving a try, even if only for temporary relief. 

Drew: I had the same experience with Doxepin when I tried the topical version (Zonalon, by Genderm). Goes to show how stuff that gets on skin soaks in to affect us from the inside. I even got thirsty, It did stop the itch. I don't use it a lot, actually very rarely.

One more item which may interest us.

Eczema: dermatitus by David Hoffman - an explanation of eczema followed by apparently authoritative herbal prescriptions. Five pages.

http://206.135.37.254/library/books/hoffman/skin/eczema.htm

As mentioned by someone, I too am interested in what 'causes' a flareup of Eczema. I thought mine was food related, but am not so sure now. Where I live has for the most part (especially wintertime) very dry air. My dermatologist stresses bathing infrequently with tepid water, and using a very good moisturizing cream/lotion especially after bathing. My eczema takes the form of red dots like chicken pox, red patches especially on the chest area. Sometimes some of it looks like acne to me. 

I don't think I will take doxepin again unless the itching gets real bad, I can't handle the fuzzy thinking and drowsiness for a week or two.

My eczema, and a whole lot of my other symptoms including my milky tongue have either cleared up or improved out of sight since I've gone on an anti candida diet. If candida is your problem - symptoms include a milky tongue, itchy ears, thrush, tinea, dandruff (yes dandruff is caused by a yeast - not candida but another fungus) then you can get a short course of anti fungals from your doctor usually, otherwise just fast for 4-7days to starve the yeast, and drink only mineral water - not tap water as this often contains chlorine which may make the problem worse. For the next few weeks avoid all sugar, coffee, refined foods and fermented products - including soy sauce - and then re-introduce them slowly.

The first time I got clear of eczema was when I met an alternative type doctor who told me that all the cortisone treatments which had been prescribed to me before were doing - was blocking up toxins that were trying to exit through my skin. [I.e. you can cure (temporarily) the symptom with those medical creams, but only exacerbate the internal problem.] 

His advice was to clean out inside combined with reflexology treatments. Essentially it was a matter of cutting out foods that increase the acid in the body. The longer I follow that regimen, the more it improves, and sometimes dissappears altogether for months. Eating fresh organic food and clean water definetly helps in my case; the only problem is that as soon as my symptoms disappear, the temptation arises to slide back to the coffee, red wine and meat habits. Where I live we do have natural unchlorinated water all the time though (for bathing and drinking); and now I grow organic fruit and vegetables, as most of the ones in the shops are loaded with pesticides anyway. 

Simon: You were talking about Prednisolone some time ago. I gather it part of your `first aid' kit. I would be interested to know how `thin' you can make your taper and keep the scratch away. I am starting a course tommorow of 30mg/day week-one, 25mg/day week-two, etc etc over five weeks finishing up wiyh 5mg a day.

Did you find that 5mg/day was enough? 

Prednisolone is a synthetic corticosteriod and is much the same as Prednisone, I believe. Medicine Net has three pages on Prednisolone which I found to be very interesting as I am just starting the drug. The material on side effects is useful to know about. You can find it on:

http://www.medicinenet.com/mainmenu/pharmacy/ARTICLE/prednsol.htm

The spelling prednsol in the address is correct.

Christopher: May I ask how you are getting on with Prednisone? In June you could not get below 40mg a day without suffering. Is that still the case? I am particularly interested because my doctor has started me on 30mg tapering over six weeks.

I can get effective results using dexamethasone .75 mg two tabs every other day. Dexamethasone .75 mg is supposed to be equivalent to 2 mg of prednisone.

Right now I am having a severe bout and will take anything for relief. My dr. said, after a week the drowsing symptoms will subside. I asked him again about the yeast and he did give me a prescription but I need to wait a week until my flare subsides, otherwise I will be taking too many medications at the same time, he says.

Hello, I have three questions that I am hoping you all can help me out with. Thanks in advance for any answers you can give to any of these questions.

1. My dermatologist seems to be a cheerleader for a topical cortisone brand named Dermatop. It is a prednicarbate emollient cream .1%. He says it is very safe to use on my face and neck regularly and it does work fairly well. Another dermatologist though said that this was too strong for my face and I was wondering what if any experiences you have had with Dermatop or if you have any insight.
2. Does anyone know if patients with chronic eczema have an increased chance of getting skin cancer? I figure that the increased replication of skin cells and immunosuppresion from cortisone may be a good breeding ground for cancer cells but I really haven't heard anything.
3. Finally, every morning I seem to have a layer of dead skin, not peeled yet, but whitened and dry, on certain areas of my face and neck. First I am curious how they got there even when I don't think I scratch much at night. Also, when I shower, I always rub this skin off revealing nice new skin underneath. I have found that when I don't rub it off, I tend to feel much more irritated since it is then painful to move my face and neck, I then tend to pick at it and then get secondary infections. I'm wondering if it is really bad to rub off my dead skin in the shower almost every day even though in the short term, it really makes me feel better.

I can only address your third question, as I avoided using cortisone whenever possible, and had never considered that there might be a link between eczema and skin cancer.

There was a period when my skin was dry and sloughing all over my body, including my face. I too rubbed off the dead cells in the shower, and had no ill effect. When I asked my Chinese doctor why the skin sloughed so much, she replied that the skin just kept pushing the dead cells to the surface, only in my case much more quickly than normal (I forget now why).

Mike, I don't know what steroid is in the ointment you mentioned. I.e. .1% of hydracortisone is relatively safe but .1% of more potent stuff would not be safe for long term use. However, sometimes a tiny amount of real potent stuff will clear my face for days; whereas if I stay with the weaker, "safer" stuff, I need to apply it heavily, never get the face totally under control, and usually end up using the strong stuff eventually! So it's hard to say which drug is "safer" when you consider all that. Plus, if you stay with a weak drug that keeps the eczema under control but doesn't clear it, the skin is still more sensitive to contact irritation and infection. There's no clear-cut answer.

I, too, have wondered about the steroid ointment and skin cancer connection. Since we try to use as little ointment as possible anyway, we probably shouldn't worry about sun; except, of course, to avoid unnecessary exposure like anyone should. I don't think the eczema itself predisposes us to skin cancer; in fact, I have had liver spots disappear after a major face flare and peeling!

If you find that gently rubbing off the loose skin in the shower makes you more comfortable, it must be the right thing for you to do. I can get by with it on the body skin, but it seems to make my face worse.

I think when the skin flakes it is acting just as if it got sunburned. Sun and allergies are both irritation that cause peeling. I too rinse a lot to get the old skin off, then I moisturize. Reversing the order, and doing one without the other is against all common sense. AND.. there must be more that will help!

But there is a dicotomy of thought here, at least. Some are saying to moisturize the skin with use of very little water. I could not stand that. I would feel unclean and I would, excuse the expression, "stink", if I did not bathe daily, not to mention my fear of increasing the risk of infection by providing a great culturing environment on the skin.

My dermatologist says use little water. He has beautiful skin. I really doubt this little water method. Although it must have truth in it, this little water theory is "used" by dermatologists who are just grasping at straws. I think it is "mentioned" because the traditional approach offers little else. They have to offer something. My doctor is new. We shall see what he offers.

I still don't hear of any large studies being quoted about ANY basic approach to this situation or others. I do hear doctors criticizing by saying certain successful procedures, which we talk about here, are anecdotal. My allergist says that the good effects are all placebo effects. But what has research said about all these things?

I used to doubt the little showering, using little water method too. I don't think that water as such is bad, and I do think that showering will sometimes remove the irritants, but since I've been showering once every two days, and only in cold water (made easy by the fact I live in the tropics) my skin has really improved. As I've said numerous times before I think it's the chlorine in the water. Why don't you try what I did and use an aloe vera or moisturising toner instead of water to moisten your face and rub off the flakey bits, then put on vaseline, or nivea or some other emollient. The thing I think is bad about the hot shower, rub-face-raw method is that it not only exposes the skin to more physical damage, it dries it out and makes it more sensitive. Since hot showers are sometimes soothing.. it becomes a vicous cycle. Try and break it! Really my face is eczema free now, and I don't stink. 

Just thought everyone might be interested in this snippet from a women's magazine...

"Dandruff is an extremely common and annoying condition. It's thought to be triggered by a yeast called Pityrosporum ovale, which is more prevalent in some people than in others. For mild dandruff, wash your hair regularly with a very mild shampoo. In more severe cases you'll need a special anti dandruff shampoo containing coal tar, selenium sulphide, pyritione or an anti fungal agent. If over-the-counter treatments don't work, consult your doctor for a stronger prescription only (this is probably cortisone based!) product. Also examine your diet and lifestyle - coffee, alcohol, sugar and refined foods may aggravet the condition and it is often stress related. Blackmores recommends trying a pre-shampoo treatment such as Apricot and Jojoba Revitalising Hot Oil Treatment, which you should leave in for half an hour, or Almond or Milk shampoo to moisturise the scalp."

I don't know about the almond or milk shampoo - but I'd take the dietry advise, along with eliminating other fermented products and taking zinc and biotin supplements.

Good dermatologists will tell you that using steroids on your eyelids is a very bad practice and must be avoided. It may lead to development of cataracts and other problems in later years.

Alicia, are you planning to put your (very intriguing) hypothesis to the test? For example, what about that chlorine filter? I just saw such a filter listed in a catalog called Self Care, which Wren told me about, I believe. This filter fits right onto your shower head. If you want specifics, let me know. It would be wonderful to find such a simple connection. I do know that too frequent showering makes me itch all over, and my skin starts to feel "tight". Maybe it is the chlorine!

I actually rang up about chlorine filters the other day, but I'm going to be moving out of my house in a couple of months - or whenever I sell it - so I thought I'd wait until I move somewhere where I know I'm going to be for a while. I also doubt the effectiveness of small shower head filters and would prefer - if I had to stay on town water - to get a larger filter to attach to the water main - which I believe are readily available here. I suggest you buy one though, if it isn't too expensive and see if it makes a difference. I think the chlorine induced candida problem could be a big one too!

I think this water thing must have a lot to do with the status of the individual's skin. The location of, degree of, and the extent of involvement of, and the cause of the eczema, must be factors. Mine is atopic eczema which means it is caused by allergy. I have allergic reactions on my skin. I am not sure if that is your situation. If not we may be talking a bit about apples and oranges to some extent, although basic skin care outside of this syndrome must apply.

Fortunately, my face is hardly involved. The rest of my body is. I think if only my face were involved the "Reduced water and increased lubricants" logic, for me would be there. Perhaps for Mike, because he mentioned only his face/neck, the reduced water and increased lubricants will work.

I don't scrub. I do use a washcloth, which my doctor says I should not use, but I use it gently. I do use Vaseline. I take cool showers. So the variable here seems to be only the frequency of the water use. 

Steve writes >>Mine is atopic eczema which means it is caused by allergy <<

I don't think that we can presume that, can we? If that was all it was we should be able to locate the allergen and get rid of it. I still have strong suspicions about infections as my skin tends to come up in infected spots without any break on the skin. It seems to come from underneath as the area is often very hot before the infected bits appear. 

Brenda, you have a good point. "Atopic" is the definition given by medical doctors. Perhaps it has the same value as the educational term for a child with learning difficulties that no-one can figure out -- dyslexic.

I do get relief from my eczema from antibiotics. Beyond any doubt. Yet, I still have major allergies beyond any doubt, which do have a direct relationship to my eczema. After a few dozen years of trying and trying foods over and over again, one learns. Of course we may find out that the foods are doing something, or our bodies are not doing something, or both, that is causing problem. Perhaps we are in the stone age of allergy knowledge.

Brenda, locating the allergy sometimes is only a small part of the battle. Getting rid of allergens are not that easy. As is avoiding them. "Getting rid of them" isn't that easy. If it was, they would be gone.

I have cataracts in my eyes. They are stable. Cataracts are more prone to develop in people with eczema, as the skin of the eyes are an extension of the skin. Using steroids magnifies the chances of cataract development.

I used to use steroid eye drops until I was seen by an eye doctor that shrunk in horror (almost) when he learned of this. Steroids in the eyes can be disasterous, as you know. Near the eyes? It can't be good.

Rinsing your eyes and nose in the shower is very helpful. Then use vitamin C regularly. Ice on your eyes, lightly if the itching is unbearable. Antihistamine eye drops are ok, I think. I have been using them a long time from many doctors. The drops are called "Naphcon A" from Alcon Laboratories in Ft. Worth Texas 76134. The drops are effective. After showering, a light coat of vaseline around the eyebrows, and the nose near the eyes, helps the skin from itching, and therefore reduces the eyes from itching.

According to this book that I have read "Allergies a disease in disguise" by an author who I forget (but it's out of print anyhow) allergies are caused by a number of things which can compromise the immune system, stress the organs and disrupt digestion. 

Things which do this can be, bacterial infections, certain drug treatments or a candida infection. I had all the symptoms of a candida infection... something which can occur if you are drinking chlorinated water because the chlorine in the water kills the digestive bacteria in your gut, means that yeast that usually competes with bacteria goes out of control, can put hyphae across the intestinal wall and you start absorbing undigested food particles into the bloodstream. The body classes these molecules as foreign and you can a hyperactive immune reponse and histamine released. 

Candida also disturbs the blood pH - I think someone else mentioned that an alkaline, anti toxin diet helped her. Anyway, the author of this book said that candida was only one cause of the "leaky gut". You don't need to be drinking chlorinated water to have a candida problem, but it certainly helps it along. Another cause could be an infection with the stomach ulcer bacteria - I forget it's name - and a course of anti-biotics may help - which maybe is what Ralph's problem is and why anti biotics help him from time to time - and some drug treatments may also damage the intestinal wall. 

Anyway for me, I know that showering in unchlorinated water isn't the total answer because obviously I've got to do something about the systemic candida in my body - fasting, taking zinc supplements, and I've also just started taking the Chinese herbs. The allergies I have are both contact and dietry. I know that if I don't shower, the areas of contact allergy - face and lower arms clear up - and the eczema on my ankles, behind the knees and on the joints are also slowly getting better - so I think I'm slowly repairing my intestine, blood pH and my organs are under less stress.

Although each case is different the author basically recommends that people - prepare their body to get well by getting rid of the candida, bacteria ... whatever the damaging agent is, then eat only raw vegies and mildly cooked food and supplement each meal with digestive enzymes bought from the health food store, and take zinc, biotin and anti -oxidant supplements. She concentrates really on the process of sensitivity, rather than finding the individual allergens.

Anyway it sounds like your eczema is probably more dietry due to damage to your intestine - especially if it's only on your joints, or hands. I think you're right that the location and extent of your eczema can define your problem to some extent... but you didn't say where you got your eczema.. but you're probably right in that showers may not be your problem. Also I didn't think that "Atopic" meant "allergenic" necessarily - I thought it described the genetic and hereditary factors involved in the dermatitis.

I didn't mean to make light of allergies - I'm aware of how serious they are for many people. I was only querying your statement that having atopic eczema meant that you had an allergy. It seems that although allergies are a frequent cause of eczema, it's likely that they are not the only cause. What I was trying to say was that allergies give you something to hang your hat on (I.e. there is at least a chance that the allergen will be identified), whereas many cases of eczema seem to defy all diagnosis. But then this is what the list is all about, isn't it? Exchanging information about what we suspect may cause our own particular eczema. Let's keep talking, and then perhaps some kind of light will begin to dawn. 

My eczema started late (at around 50) and I've never really tried to establish what caused it. All I know is that around that time I was having real heat problems, and eczema often seems to be associated with heat. I tend to be rather allergic, with hay fever, hives etc, so allergy may well have played a part. Also, my internal arrangements seem to be a bit temperamental, so the fungal thing may come into it.

The eczema started on my hands and stayed there for some time. Then it suddenly started spreading, and finished up all over the place. I had a mixture of types - vesicles, dry swollen skin and infected spots. Prednisone got rid of it temporarily, but it came back as soon as the course was finished. Then I saw a programme on TV about a Chinese doctor in London who had queues at her door every day for eczema treatment. A doctor at Great Ormond Street Hospital for Children was very interested in it, and worked with her to formulate a standard prescription which could be used for a variety of cases. It's not the usual way of doing it as Chinese herbalists like to prescribe individually. Your presciption will vary every time you get it, presumably according to the progress of the condition.

After this I went to a Chinese doctor for about 5-6 weeks. It's impossible to know what you're getting, but it's a mixture of leaves, seeds, bark and some powdered material. The effect was almost immediate, though it took a few weeks to completely disappear. I also used a herbal wash on the worst itchy bits, but it's impossible to tell how effective that was. A very restricted diet was recommended with all the fun things in life taken off it, but this was only for the course of the treatment to allow it to work.

This was 4 years ago, and since then I've only been back to the doctor once. I have bits and pieces of eczema still, I take great care to keep my skin moisturised, and if necessary I dab a bit of steroid cream on, but I've had nothing like my earlier condition. I still get allergic reactions to various things so it obviously made no difference to that, but they're not serious. I believe the treatment is more successful if you haven't had eczema for a lengthy period, which was the case with me. There seems to be no kind of guarantee of who will get relief, so the only solution seems to be to "suck it and see".

After the treatment I felt like a new woman, but of course it's impossible to tell whether that was because my skin had cleared or because some underlying complaint had been removed. I had been really afraid to go to the Chinese doctor as I felt it was a last resort, and if it didn't work then there was nowhere else to go. I certainly wasn't convinced it would work, so I don't think it was a question of mind over matter.

Incidentally, the doctor had on his wall reports of many cases of asthma which he had treated - another allergy complaint?

Western medicine doesn't like it of course as it isn't properly controlled, but I take comfort from the fact that the Chinese have been practising medicine a lot longer than the West.

As I understand it, ECZEMA means a dry, probably allergic type rash. ATOPIC means not confined to any particular area; either all over the body or clearing and breaking out in various areas at various times. The term ATOPIC also is used to describe allergic conditions in general; I.e. the ATOPIC TRIAD is eczema, asthma and sinusitis. So a person with just hand or behind -the- knee eczema technically doesn't have ATOPIC DERMATITIS; although they may be considered an ATOPIC INDIVIDUAL if they also have asthma or hayfever. Someone out there with more medical knowledge: please correct me if I'm wrong.

The discussion about doxepin caught my attention and made me wonder about whether others on the list are plagued by hives in addition to their eczema.

I have suffered with eczema off and on all my life. These days I live with regular facial flares and constant eczema on one hand only. But I also suffer from what have become in recent years chronic bouts of hives.

My dermatologist prescribed doxepin to help me through bad times of itch and at 10 miligrams a day it seemed to help a little -- at 20 milligrams it helped a little more. The intensity of the burning with my facial flares was reduced, the flares seemed not to last as long and the hives didn't seem so bad.

At first I felt sedated and naseous on the doxepin but I perserved and those side effects passed.

But when the hives and flares still broke through, the doctor increased my dose to 25 milligrams. After a month on that dosage I had to stop. It was giving me borerline migraine symptoms where I trouble focusing with my eyes -- and while I was on 25 milligrams I had the worst facial flare I have in months.

What to make of it all? Can your body adjust to the doxepin to the point where it is no longer effective as an anti-histamine?

No more medical knowledge - just a fully qualified hypochondriac - but I have the impression that "atopic" refers to the fact that the eczema is not caused by an external source, like contact dermatitis. My medical book lists it as an endogenous eczema, or one caused by an internal condition. 

You're pretty much right on target, according to my copy of Taber's Cyclopedic Medical Dictionary.... 

I have a nine month old son who has been diagnosed with Atopic Dermatitis. He has recently (2 days ago) had his second flare-up.

We are currently using Westcort .2% hydrocortisone .2% ointment 2 times a day and putting on copious amounts of petroleum jelly also 2 times a day. After our sons first flare-up this is what we were told to do for three weeks and it worked wonderfully. When we are not dealing with a flare-up we use cortate 1% hydrocortisone 1% ointment (the 1% is not supposed to be as strong as the .2%.).

We are looking at taking a three pronged approach to dealing with our sons eczema:

1. Try to find out what the trigger(s) is/are. To do this we will be trying different foods on a three day rotational basis and looking into our use of household cleansers and other household chemicals. (we think that this last flare-up might have been brought on by the cleaner we use for our bathtub. We immediately gave him a bath after cleaning the bathtub and his flareup happened soon after.) 
2. Look into things to keep the eczema under control. In between flare-ups what should we do to keep the skin healthy and comfortable. e.g. types of soaps to use, alternatives to laundry detergents, ways to reduce itching etc. I realize that in some instances this might seem to be the same as the first approach but there are some differences. 
3. Find ways to help the eczema flare-ups recede as quickly as possible.

Ignatius, from my own experience, the causal affect of a flare up may be not only hard to find, but can vary from known factors to unknown factors. Therefore, I am hopeful that there is a specific (or a set of specific factors) which you can eliminate, but be prepared for that not being the case. There may also be other triggers such as stress, etc., which are also hard to pin down and/or eliminate. For me, sometimes UV light treatments help (only sometimes) while for others who have posted to this list they are of negative value. The important thing is to pursue all your ideas and give support to your son who may have to learn to deal with these flare ups periodically throughout his life....it can also disappear just as quickly as it appears and not reappear for long periods or forever. 

Well, yes, there is hope. I'm a living example. My skin looked like hash last Christmas. Now my eczema is barely visible. But each person has to find what therapy works for themselves; CHT works for me.

To find a good qualified practitioner you have to become a detective. Call acupuncturists. Ask them who if they know anyone who is EXPERT at using Chinese methods on skin problems. Ask if they use Chinese herbs, or for an expert, experienced, licensed herbologist. Then when you think you've found a qualified doctor, ask them about ALL of your concerns. Ask for patient references. Ask yourself if you feel comfortable with this doctor. My doctor, Dr. Yu, also teaches. Maybe a local acupuncture or herbology school could lead you to an expert.

I don't know of any dermatological acupuncture associations or lists. And, as we've discussed on the list just recently, one person's heroic doctor can be another person's bad experience. You've got to judge for yourself.

I've had acupuncture for various maladies from a number of different practitioners over the years. I only took CHT before for menstrual difficulties (with a different acupunturist than Dr. Yu), and it worked for me then too. But I've had gone to a couple of inexperienced acupuncturists who were not effective. In short, in my experience, the more experienced the acupuncturist, the better the treatment.

CHT might work for you, and it might not. I have no idea. According to Dr. Yu, it can work with everyone, however, it does take longer to work in people who have used steroids. According to the CHT studies done in England, if memory serves, it worked 60% of the time on the patients who had had no success with any other treatment. 

Since we all have different symptoms, it may not be useful to list all the changes. I, for example, had a terrible time sleeping. Dr. Yu put some herbs in my mix to help me sleep. I now get a full, deep 8+ hours each night. The sores are gone all over my body, except slight cracks on my hands. Both my inability to concentrate (due to) and my constant itching are gone.

Hi Brenda I find the sunlight really helpful to my eczema. In my case the eczema generally comes back towards the end of winter (this is where we are now in South Africa). Somehow wearing warm clothes all the time seems to stop it from being able to "breathe" so it gets worse for me as winter progresses. I try and expose it to as much sun as possible over weekends and find that does provide some temporary relief. Better still is sunlight combined with sea water. (Usually when you get this combination you would also be unstressing which is also beneficial). Come springtime and I have a dietary cleanout - avoid coffee, alcohol, sugar and acidic foods - spend time in sunshine and sea water....... that is when I manage to clear it up again for a few months.

PS- My dog gets eczema too! She gets it in summer really badly. I think in her case its a grass allergy as she gets worse after walks in the long grass.

Sophie, my 5 month old, has eczema. From birth she had itchy skin that seemed to come and go but 2 weeks ago she had a nasty flare up and we were given lots of creams and told not to give her any dairy products. I had fed her a packet vegetable hot pot thingy that had milk powder in it and the Dr seemed to think that this had caused it. So now I have also given up dairy products as I am breastfeeding . I'm not sure if this helps but it gets rid of my guilt. 

I had also been using Eucerin lotion and aristicort o.2 daily but have not used it for the last 2 days and she seems to be getting better. The medication appeared to be irritating her skin and I have also had a rash on my hands. Is there a connection I wonder? 

As we live in a very humid and hot environment we use aircon a great deal and I am trying not to let the air get too dry. Could the pollution be the problem? Sophie's problem does not appear to be as serious as some I have read about but I am nevertheless worried and being a new mum am slightly manic about it. 

I also have children who suffer with eczema. It breaks my heart to see them uncomfortable, and itchy with raw sores on their otherwise beautiful skin. My daughter has had eczema since she was 3 months old. I have searched and searched for the "wonder cure" but I am coming to the realization that it doesn't exist--yet. I will still keep looking and hoping but I guess you could say I have become realistic. My main focus now is to keep my kids as comfortable as possible and to help them to deal with this disease from a psycological aspect.

Does anyone out there have suggestions on how to deal with the psycological aspect of this disease in children?

As far as the treatment of eczema- I can give you a few suggestions that have helped my kids. To moisturize the skin OINTMENT such as Aquaphor is better than cream such as Eucerine. I was told by an allergist that this is due to the alcohol found in creams (the alcohol is an emulsifier that is found in all creams and makes it creamy) The alcohol is drying to the skin.

DOMEBORO solution also helps to keep them comfortable. It comes in a powder which you mix with water and place on the skin with compresses. We use a cloth diaper which holds a lot of moisture.

With the steroids (which I try to avoid) I use the OINTMENT type triamcinolone.

Also I am wondering about the "vegetable hot pot thingy" you talked about I'm not sure if I know what that is but you may want to check the label for preservatives or MSG. Both of my kids are sensitive to foods which contain lots of chemicals. 

I understand that the best material to wear to avoid irritation to eczema is 100% cotton. Can anybody tell me if this is correct or of any other materials that do not irritate the skin

My son is due to start school in Sept and is required to wear school uniform. and we are having difficulty in finding pure cotton school trousers. 

Try a company called 'Cotton On' who are based in Bath (Monmouth Place, BA1 2XF). Telephone 01225 461155, Fax 01225 461464. They have an extensive range. The company was started in 1980 by Dorothy Clark who's young daughter was a sufferer.

I don't know about other materials but my family have found that cotton is preferable to any other material. We once bought some 'pure cotton' underware for my daughter (not from Cotton On) and were surprised that she had a reaction where the seams touched her skin. We checked and found that although the body of the clothing was 100% cotton, the seams were finished with a synthetic thread - hence the problem. personally, I have never been able to wear woolen garments that may contact my skin and many synthetics make me sweat.

Hi Monika I have exactly the same problem as yours, though not as bad. I've had this thing for as long as I can remember but it wasn't always in the form Palmo-Plantaris pustulosis. It used to be quite dry and itchy behind my knees and the inside of my elbows. 

Now I get these tiny little blisters along the outside edge of my hands and the odd "biggy" on my palms. I've found that if I wear shoes that don't let my feet breathe then I get the pustules appearing around the edge and sole of my feet, so I always wear "buckskin" type leather. Doc Martin does some good boots which, coincidentally, are currently fashionable. Other than this I can't seem to find any physical reason why I get flare ups, do you live in a hardwater area? Does it get worse when you move house? (mine does), or when the weather is hot (and you perspire more). 

I use a combination of Alpha Kiri bath oil, Unguentum Merk and Dermovate. I think the last two are the only things which keep my hands under control. I've found that Doctors are hesitant to subscribe Dermovate (if they don't know you) as it is a potent steroid, but if you patronise THEM a little and make sure they know that you know how to use it you'll be ok. 

For me one or two days application of the Dermovate causes the blisters to dry up and I spend the rest of the week picking at hard dry skin (hence the Unguentum Merk). I hope this all sounds familiar, I think the pustulosis is one of the more socially embarrassing forms of eczema, when it first started it really freaked me out, I kept (sorry to gross you out) bursting my finger and thumb hoping it would go away but it just got damper. I kept my hands in my pockets all the time and would avoid shaking hands with people. 

The Betnovate I was using did no good unless I used it in vast quantities, my skin got so thin in places that at a gig once I clapped so hard my skin broke and started to bleed. The Dermovate was a Godsend it may be more potent but I don't use a tenth of what I used before and I just use it in very localised areas.

Sorry this is such a long and disgusting e-mail but I figure what the hell, let it all out.

Brenda, like Gill the sunlight appears to have a beneficial effect on my eczema. The sunscreen I use is manufactured by "Banana Boat", and my skin doesn't seem to mind it. Actually my skin does the best during the summer months. Like with Gill it becomes problematic during the winter.

I used to think that sunlight was good for my skin too. Every summer any eczema or dry skin that I had during winter just cleared up. In fact it was one of the reasons why I moved - because I thought that the tropics would be good for my skin. But it's been worse up here than it has anywhere. Now I'm looking forward to going to a cooler climate again.

I heard some-where that hay-fever and some other allergies work in long term cycles active for 7 years dormant for another 7 years. Has anyone noticed the same with eczema? I've had it for as long as I can remember but I do remember periods when it was dormant but they coincide with years when I wasn't living in England so I can't be sure.

Also my eczema has changed location and appearance over the years, when I was about 4-7 it was behind of my knees and elbows and very itchy. Then it vanished when I went to live abroad. On returning to England it reappeared for a time around my mouth, especially the corners, I was about 11 or 12. I now live in a hard water area in the south east and it concentrates it self (after disappearing for a time) on my hands, and looks nothing like it did before. I still get flare ups of the original form under my bottom lip and my back where my belt rubs. My "normal" eczema is dry and scaly, while the type that appears on my hands starts of as tiny pustules which dry and crack as I treat the area with Dermovate.

I wonder if the doctors are making a mistake by grouping dermatitis and eczema into one area. My wife sometimes gets a red rash at the edge of her scalp and the bridge of her nose, is this eczema? How can one disease have so many different symptoms? Is it even a disease? Is it purely an allergic reaction? 

The symptoms you describe sound like eczema, but, as you say, this term encompasses a whole medical text book of skin problems. One possibility for the cause is not an allergy to the gloves themselves but to the bugs that live in them. Dust mites live of human skin and their waste products are thought to cause a number of allergic reactions include asthma and eczema. You can go for years without any problem then suddenly have a reaction. Thinking back, I remember that my hands got particularly bad after buying a pair of thinsulate gloves for winter cycling.

I've wondered if I have become allergic to pollen. The thing is that I have never had a problem with these types of allergies. I understand that the human body changes over the years, and that a person could eventually become sensitive to this. 

I don't suffer from the typical pollen allergie, I.e. sinus problems that I know of. Occasionally my eyes get itchy, and my nose gets a little stuffed up, but thats it. I've noticed that alot of people in this group do in fact have the 'hayfever' type of allergy. I've had eczema for 3 years now.....its always been a problem in the winter time(dry air), but the summers were OK. 

I run alot and in past summers I would get a fair amount of sun. This summer is different.....I've suffered with eczema like the winters. Something has changed, and I don't know what. I now drink distilled water, bathe for only a short time with barely warm water, use a good quality moisturizer after showering, and I don't eat foods that I 'think' cause flareups, like chocolate, tomatoes, garlic. I don't know, I'm as confused about this stuff as the rest of us.

I got the shivers when I read about your apartment being "Terribly moldy". Mold allergies can be almost devastating depending on you and the kind/degree of mold. Of course I don't know if you are allergic to mold, but I would immediately do everything possible to find out and then reduce in every way possible, the mold in your apartment.

STORY ONE I moved into a new apartment which was moldy. I immediately began suffering. I had to stay there for a while until I found a new place. While I was suffering I scrubbed all the walls with a solution of vinegar and a little detergent, washed the little stinky drapes and mopped the floor with the same solution. I found a huge relief. The doctor had recommended vinegar.

ST0RY TWO I put on a shirt that had been in a drawer for a month or so and within five minutes I felt like fire-ants were all over my torso and welts began to rise. As soon as I took a shower I got immediate relief. I took some antihistamine and in about a half hour I was almost comfortable. I had sniffed the shirt, and had noticed a musty odor, but I don't think you can always count on smelling the offending mold.

COMMON SMELLY EXPERIENCES Our noses play tricks on us when we have been in one place for a while. We become accustomed to our home's smells and don't notice them, until we leave for a long time and then return. But we do notice the different smells of other people's homes. The same is true of cars', stores', movies' air-conditioners. Sometimes I become uncomfortable with no noticeable odors. Sometimes I notice the odor. If a store smells I stay out.

FIX-IT So...... wash everything with vinegar and a little detergent, including the air-conditioning filter. If there is anything contributing to the dampness in your apartment, fix it. If you don't have air-conditioning, let the breezes blow through your well dusted apartment or use fans to prevent stagnet warm air pockets where mold is more likely to fluorish. If you are storing anything in the apartment, get it out. The less stuff the better. If you have a carpet, remove it. Have a bare bedroom that you can mop with vinegar. If you find any other mold controlling techniques, let us know.

A MOVING CONFIRMATION If you find out that you ARE allergic to mold you are not sure of the extent of the problem, leave the apartment for two or three days making sure you go into a dry mold free atmosphere. If you feel better you know you had sentenced yourself to an apartment of torture and the longer you stay there the more you will inflict yourself with torture.

If all this is to no avail, at least you will be able to cross mold off your list and go on to other trials. That will be a major accomplishment. When you finish the trial you will have done your spring cleaning a little early.

A note on CHT, Monika wrote: "I have tried the Chinese herbs but with no much luck. It seemed to cured it at first but after seven weeks of VERY expensive treatment I wasn't getting very far. At the end I had to give it up."

I guess like everything else, alternative medicine only works on some people. Like me, Monika has Palmo-Plantaris pustulosis and perhaps Chinese herbs are unaffective on this type of eczema only.

A girl I meet last Christmas said that she'd had eczema all through her childhood, then went to India for a few months - where it cleared up, and doesn't get it at all now (5years later). Also my eczema has all changed form and position - although I've just thought that it just a matter of extent of reaction. The old dry scaley eczema would weep if it got bad enough, now that I live in a hotter climate and my skin is always moist - it's more the weepy stuff, and only becomes dry and scaley after the rash has appeared and the damaged skin is coming off. Do you think it's something to do with our modern society's - chlorinated water, air con and central heating, etc... that is making up hypersensitive?

Drew, Sorry to hear of Doxepin's side effects. At the moment I am taking D with prednisone, so I cannot tell if the drowsiness will be a problem, but it does relieve itching. I am hoping when I get off prednisone, I will not have the side effects. My dermatologist said the side effects usually fade with continued use after about two weeks. How long did you use D?

I'm still persevering with nothing except for Aqueous ointment which at least seems to have a soothing affect. However, a friend was looking at Sophies rash the other day and suggested maybe it was prickly heat. The rash is worst on her chest and chin. Is there a connection between eczema and prickly heat? I know that in Thailand people and babies are covered in either talcum or prickly heat powder after baths or swimming.

My interest is due to my daughter (20 months old) who has been suffering from severe atopic eczema from about 9 months of age. She has been treated by a homoeopath since December last year. The treatment seems to be helping, but it's been a long and painful process, and I confess to having severe doubts about the homoeopathic method. Can any of you report successful homoeopathic treatments?

My biggest problem with the homoeopathic treatment, is that it does nothing to provide symptomatic relief, and excludes the use of conventional topical medications such as antihistamines and steroids. I would be interested in hearing of other alternative treatments which might relieve her suffering. 

I've just bought a chlorine filter shower head. In the package came a whole lot of documentation about the effects of chlorine. It said that more chlorine is absorbed by showering and breathing in the vapour than across the skin in a bath, or by drinking it in drinking water. Despite that however, chlorine in the drinking water is poisonous and at high rates has been shown to produce cancer, high blood pressure, malfunctioning liver, and allergies....

Another tip someone else gave me about restoring skin condition is to add vinegar and a dash of bath oil to a luke warm - not hot - bath. The skin's protective layer - which guards against infections - is slightly acidic, and vinegar in the bath maintains the acidity which chlorinated or hard water may not.The bath oil stops the water drying the skin out. Anyway having just read about the chlorine vapour from showers, and the fact that bathing is actually better than showering - I've been giving it a ago and can report that it's been wonderful. (I always loved a good bath!) My skin is soft and supple and not so itchy on the dry eczema patches. I recommend it.

I have a daughter aged 8 who has severe eczema. We tried using homeopathic treatment when she was about 3 and I regard it as a disaster of the months we used it her eczema and general health deteriorated somuch that she could not walk and was exhausted all the time.

Since then we have used topical steroids/oil of primrose which work a bit, though not spectacularly well and she has frequent and severe flares. We have tried a variety of other "remedies" - Chinese herbal tea, porridge in the bath, every emollient we've heard of - to no avail.

The treatment I have found most useful is wet wraps.

From what I've read since I've been on this list, homeopathic treatment does not have much of a record of success with eczema. I've tried it myself, desperately believing that it would work, but the effects were negligible and any change in my skin was probably only due to the normal fluctuations in eczema.

Hi John. I have been using topical steroids for much of my life (I'm now 25). I have had several remissions so the use hasn't been constant, and my eczema is very localised so I don't have to use great quantities. I started on Betnovate which is a relatively mild steroid but as I have gotten older and my eczema has changed it's characteristics (from dry and itchy to weeping blisters) I have had to use more potent steroids. I am now using Dermovate ointment, and a lot of Unguentum Merk emollient. I am quite careful with it and always give my skin a break from it when the cycle is at it's most inactive. I've found that constant use does thin the skin quite dramatically hence the precautions.

Without the Dermovate the flare ups are quite vicious they leads to broken and bleeding skin which begins to heal and then flares up again. With the Dermovate which I use as soon as I see the signs of a flare up, the pustules dry up and the skin gets hard like a callus. this eventually cracks and peels like a scab, the skin below heals slowly and I stop using the steroid. Another flare up usually doesn't occur for a couple of weeks enough time for the skin to heal completely. This is a much better state of afairs than constantly damaged skin.

This regime has kept me relatively free from big flare ups without any of the serious side affects. I feel that there is no such thing as a "safe" medication and you have to take precautions as with every thing else. With a little knowledge you can safely use topical steroids in the long term.

However, topical steroids will never cure the problem.

I will tell you about my experience with homeopathy but please note - everyone reacts VERY differently to different treatments. What works for one will not work for another.

I have never had good reactions to homeopathic treatment. And I have not met anyone who has had success with clearing, stabilising or lessening their eczema. I went on a homeopathic regimen last year and ended up at the A&E (ER) crying for some cortisone. My falre up was so chronic that I had not slept in six weeks - the itching was unbarable.

I put it down to the*idea* of homeopathy - ie like treats like. I presume that I was given drops containing substances which I was reacting to - this was in an attempt to "help" my system tolerate them or learn how to propertly react to them. All I did was get very sick. Now - I am not saying that this will happen for everyone. AND I could have the theory behind homepathy buggered up but it did not work for me and I will never try it again.

There was one plus to come out of the months of hell and that was the diagnosis of a candida infestation which I am currently overcoming and the results in my skin are amazing.

When the weather turns hot and humid I get small bubbles of fluid under the skin on my fingers. These are very itchy and easily become inflamed if I give in and scratch them. I assume they are "prickly heat" (that is sweat that cannot escape) and not related to eczema, but I could be wrong.

I find that calamine lotion is the best treatment as it soothes away the itch, together with an emollient and maybe an antiseptic if required.

My experience is that Doxepin side effects (drowsiness) fade within a month, if not sooner. One solution is to take it before you go to bed. You should then continue to see some benefits during the day, but without the drowsiness. When itching becomes severe, you can then take a lesser amount of doxepin or atarax (cousin of doxepin) during the day as needed.

I always put a little vinegar in the bath these days. It seems to lessen the itching and be generally good for your skin. The skin is slightly acidic and chlorinated and some hard water is can be slightly alkaline.

But isn't the vinegar acidic?

>> But isn't the vinegar acidic? <<

Exactly and it maintains the acid mantle of the skin. This protects the skin against infection. Alkaline water breaks the acid mantle.

I am sorry to have to say that, from my observation of the postings on this list, homeopathy does not seem to have much of a reputation. That's to say I have not detected any enthusiasm from those on the list who are using homeopathy as a means of curing eczema.

I have a few spots on my chins and behind my ears. They have been scratched open. Two of them are as big as capital letter O. I want them to heal before they open up even bigger. I have been using Hydrocortisone on them. Alternatively, use Diprosone for 3 days and back to Hydrocortisone. On top of it, I also use lubriderm. Before bed, I put Sarna anti-itching lotion on them. I also take atarax at bedtime. I just finished my 10-day antibiotics. Any suggestion on this matter?

Ken, I will just jump on my "death to antibiotics" bandwagon for a moment! If you have taken antibiotics you may need to help along your gut bacteria which would have been killed off by antibiotics (thus allowing candida to proliferate). Acidophilus is avavilable from your health food shop and this will assist as will removing all fermented foods from your diet.

Nan, I'm sure you've tried it, but pure petroleum jelly (vaseline) has a good track record as a non-allergenic moisturizer. It's the only thing I've found that doesn't bother me and also truely holds the moisture in. I used to think I was allergic to anything that itched or flared me out when I applied it. Now, I know that sometimes just touching the skin will set it off and that in the long run the vaseline helps albeit with stained clothes and a greasy look.

David, Sounds to me like you've got Palmo-Plantaris pustulosis. Which is a type of eczema which appears where the skin is thick and is prone to sweating i.e. the soles of the feet, and palms of the hands and edges of the fingers. I use a potent steroid ointment on it for a fast solution. And emollient keeps it away once the steroid has done it's stuff. These areas are also prone to emotional sweating so stress can be a factor. If you find an affective fast treatment I'd love to know.

Sam and Julia both reported a severe deterioration after commencing homeopathic treatment. Do you believe that this was caused by the treatment, or merely a result of the cessation of conventional therapy?

The reason I ask, is that from a chemical point of view, there is absolutely nothing in a homeopathic medicine apart from distilled water and alcohol. The original solution derived from the active ingredient is diluted to the point where the odds are millions to on against encountering a single molecule of the original substance. Hence the reaction a person with an essentially logical and scientific world view such as myself would expect, is no reaction whatsoever.

So I would regard any reaction whatsoever, even a negative reaction, as being encouraging evidence that there is something to homeopathy apart from wishful thinking and placebo effect.

The whole field of homeopathy is impossible to evaluate objectively. It is either a revololutionary and miraculous form of healing which forces us to rethink our entire world view, or a load of dangerous nonsense. I have no doubt that the homeopaths I have spoken to are very sincere and committed people. They say they have no need for scientific validation of there method. They cure people every day (so they say), so what more proof do they need? However, they are quick to take credit for an improvement in a patients condition, and when the treatment is ineffective, this is because they 'have not yet found the correct remedy for the patient', or because the patient gets fed up with the slowness and ineffectiveness of the treatment, and gives up.

Homeopathy is concerned with finding an ultimate cure for the disease (or dis-ease as they say), and ignoring the physical symptoms, no matter how much discomfort they may cause. Conventional medicine on the other hand, is concerned with relieving the physical symptoms of what they believe to be an incurable and chronic malady. Unfortunately the two approaches seem to be incompatible - I wish that a middle road could be found.

Our homeopath has also told us some things that I regard as contentious and worthy of discussion in this forum:

1. That the link between infantile eczema and asthma in later is often the result of the use of steroid creams on infants. The theory is that the eczema is the outward appearance of an inner imbalance, or dis-ease. The steroid creams repress this manifestation, pushing the dis-ease back into the body, instead of releasing it as homeopathic treatment aims to do. The end result of this repression is that the disease manifests itself in later life, typically as asthma or hayfever. Revolutionary medicine or bunkum?
2. That infantile eczema can be caused or aggravated by inoculations, which can also provoke other dangerous side-effects such as infant seizures, which the doctors are not telling us about. Our homeopath also claims that our daughter Eimer's condition was aggravated and possibly caused by vaccinations which my wife had when she was pregnant with Eimer, but before she knew she was pregnant.

I also have the same type of eczema that you and Monika have. I didn't realize that it had a name. The eczema on my feet seems to be related to a fungal infection I also get on my feet. It took the dermatologists I saw months to figure this out. For me I've found Mycolog cream to work best (at least for my feet). I use Temovate (.25%) on my hands which seems to keep the eczema under control. The sun also helps my skin.

Does your Alicia ever get thrush? If so maybe you should talk to your doctor about anti-fungacides and maybe also supplement her diet with zinc and digestive enzymes. It would make sense if the eczema is bad in hot weather and after swimming. My infantile ezcema also cleared up when I was about 3 after my family moved out of town and onto rainwater collected in a tank. I didn't get eczema again until I was about 19, although I've always had asthma and have been allergy sensitive. So maybe a water filter for your shower would be good.

I reckon it's worth a try.

My own experience with the homeopath has been less-than-perfect; and it seems most if not all of the people on the list who have tried the homeopathic approach report similar results. (However, the sample size, less than 120, is hardly enough for a scientific conclusion.)

Certainly, my homeopath has taken the point of view that eventually he will find a 'cure' for my eczema, and I can continue visiting him at no charge until he gets to the root of the problem. The problem here, as John indicates, is that this approach gives the homeopath a perfect out -- when a patient quits in frustration, the homeopath can claim he didn't try hard enough.

From what I've seen so far, efforts to test the homeopathic hypothesis scientifically (including taking into account the approach's claims of indivduality in care) have failed. That does not mean homeopathy does not work for some if not all. Since there is 'nothing' in the homeopathic remedies, it does no harm to try.

My explorations into alternative therapies will shortly move into 'environmental medicine'. When I told my dermatologist about this, his eyes turned. He said the environmental physician will likely say I have a yeast problem. But since the environmental physician is also an MD, he has no objection. (He does, I believe rightfully, object to experimenting with Chinese herbal remedies, pointing out that they may be effective because of untested drugs that may be stronger than the steroidal perscriptions.)

I certainly believe we should keep our eyes and minds open. Medicine is not a pure science, and eczema, we appreciate, is a vexing and irritating problem.

Dear Ann, Thanks for the suggestion. We have used Vaseline and put up with the greasy feel. Right now, we are having a go with mineral oil. I'm afraid to see what will happen when my daughter hits puberty.

Good point John. However, prior to commencing the homeopathic treatment the only conventional therepy I was using was small amounts of topical steriods. Almost immediately (two days) after starting homeopathic therepy I had a severe breakout which I could only, at the time, put down to the therepy. I was warned by the homeopath that I would get worse before I got better but a few months of pain and itch and sleeplessness was too much for me to handle. The fact that the glands in my groin were huge didn't seem to faze the homepath but it sure scared me.

It could have been the alcohol in the solution that I reacted to.

Even so I don't *completely* disbelieve the idea. I think that there is some credence to the "like cures like" concept (hair of the dog anyone?).

I put vaseline on *before* entering the shower. I find this helps maintain the body's natural oils which, of course, are the best for maintaining skin quality. An important property of vaseline (as opposed to mineral oil or Aquaphor I think) is that it doesn't get washed away by hot water. After the shower, instead of towel drying I just put on a terry cloth robe until I'm dry. This also minimizes removal of natural body oil. 

I have used this program for the last six months and am completely convinced that it works (it was recommended to me a my dermatologist, the best doctor I've ever had). The program has allowed me to virtually eliminate use of steroid ointments, which I had used daily during the previous ten years. I am also now experimenting with drinking flax seed oil, a fatty acid that the skin loves, as suggested by numerous people on this list. As for puberty, my impression is that your daughter's eczema is more likely to improve than worsen once she reaches that stage. However, she may get the eczema back in later years (usually after age 30; but by then treatments should be much better).

Hi Jeff I read somewhere that the most common allergic causes of childhood eczema are dairy products and eggs. Has she started drinking cows milk since she stopped breastfeeding?

Thanks for the strategy tip. We have not used that approach before. We will have to try it because we seem to have had another outbreak.

Does anyone else have problems after swimming? I know that Alicia's mom mentioned that she did? My daughter's skin is raw after dipping in the ocean. She has the same reaction whether she swims in pools or ponds.

What an intriguing idea, to put on Vaseline before showering! I'm going to give this a try. I enjoy exercise so I usually shower every day. I've been using moisturizing lotions after showers, but found that this is a mixed blessing because I'm allergic to wool and every moisturizing lotion and bath oil I've found contains Lanolin. My skin feels a little better after I drown it with Eucerin, but it is red and irritated at the same time.

I noticed that if I don't shower after every workout, my skin feels better, but walking around with dried sweat can sometimes present its own problems.

If I may ask, how much vaseline do you put on? Do you put it only on areas where you have eczema or anywhere where your skin is dry? Do you use vaseline before showers everytime you shower or only occasionally?

I would imagine that putting vaseline on before showering is somewhat equivalent to covering up the skin under the vaseline so that area is essentially not washed. This sounds a lot better than not washing the whole body.

Nan: Many women with eczema improve when they hit puberty (including myself) so look forward to it, rather than being afraid of it. My theory is that female hormones are good for many women with eczema. Many women's skin gets worse when they go through menopause, which supports the same theory.

My skin was horrible from birth till puberty at age 14, then was pretty good until age 28 when it returned with a vengeance. (That's 14 years bad, and 14 years good, which seems to follow the long-term cycle theory someone proposed.) Now it seems to be on a 7 year cycle, since it improved at bit at age 35. I'm now 39, so I assume that in 3 more years or so I will go through hell all over again. 

My dermatologist advises against heavy exercising when I have a significant eczema flare, as the sweat irritates the skin. However, you can still do low impact, non-sweat-generating exercise like brisk walking.

I put vaseline on all over my body. I go through a 13 ounce tub about every 3 or 4 weeks (but Vaseline, in addition to being a great lubricant, is also cheap). The all-body approach is a preventative, not a treatment. It prevents the skin from getting dry or irritated enough to break out in eczema. I put vaseline on almost every time I shower. I am sensitive to the fact that I may not be getting as clean and so, about once a week, I put it on *after* I shower, making sure to clean really well.

I point out that showering every day is an artifact of the current half-century. Throughout all previous history, most people felt that showering/bathing once a week was good enough. Recently, I came across a report written by an army camp commander in the late 1800s. He said he was most impressed with the clean habits of his men because they bathed once a week. In any case, I was originally concerned that I might not get clean enough (using vaseline) to remove bacteria leading to infections in the skin. But so far this has not proved to be a problem. The real problem was that before, I was using large amounts of steroid ointment and this was depressing my skin's natural immune system, leading to infections. Since I started using vaseline as described, this problem has cleared up. 

Sorry to be a naysayer but my skin was at its worst at puberty. It was a hell of a time for me (perhaps a little easier than some as I went to girls only schools). Puberty is an already bad time and having a face like raw hamburger was so distressing. I remember telling some people that I had been in a fire to explain the rash.

Some days I would weep at the thought of having to go to school and get on the bus with people staring. My mother would never let me stay away from the cruel eye of the public and I do not know whether this was a bad thing or not. I know that I just desperately wanted to stay in my room with my books.

I think that the decision whether or not to allow your daughter to 'hide' is a deeply personal one. I do not know if my life would be any different if my mother had allowed it (and as far as I am concerned not an avenue worth exploring - what's done is done).

Now I can make those decisions for myself and I do hide away when my rash is bad. It is easier. Not only becuase I hate people staring, it is simply becuase I do not feel very happy with myself, and I am in pain (this must be remembered - it is not just a cosmetic thing this eczema - the rash is *very* painful) and thus feel that there is no point in being with other people.

Even though puberty for me was years ago I can remember it clearly. I hope that your daughter does not suffer a worsening of her condition during that time but hey, I survived it and I am as "well adjusted" as the next idiot.

When I hit puberty I had the exact opposite response. My eczema was more weepy and covering 85% of my body, instead of the normal patches I used to have. I still believe to this day that the medicines I was prescribed had a lot to do with it being that I lost my hair as well. 

Puberty is the worse time to be dealing with eczema and the ignorance and torment children give to each other. This is the time in most peoples lives when they learn to communicate and meet new people, eczema seriously hindered my ability to do so. On a good note, at age 19 I am cleared except for just three small patches and a few scars and considered to be relatively normal :).

Jeff, If Alicia is drinking cows milk (Gill's note) then perhaps you could substitute that for soya milk or soya based formula. My Doctor suggested the following three; Isomil,Prosbee or Allsoy. I use the occasional bottle and Sophie (6 months) loves it. We have also eliminated all dairy products,eggs and yeast . The Dr also suggested not swimming which is not that helpful but now we shower immediatly after. Sophie's skin is definitely improving. 

What about trying Bag Balm? Petrolatum with an antiseptic in it (but it DOES have lanolin, for anyone who's sensitive to that). I find it's wonderful when my hands are really bad, I just coat my hands and put cotton gloves on at night before going to bed, in the morning my hand are smooth and soft. It's really been helping a flareup I've been having on my eyelids, too, as it has a higher "melting point" than plain vaseline, and doesn't run into my eyes as it gets warm.

I've noticed that most pharmacies are starting to carry Bag Balm now, one doesn't have to have a farmer friend pick it up for you at the local Feed and Grain....

I had eczema pretty badly as a child. For a while, it tapered off, but once I became pregnant, at 30, it returned again (although in different locations). During every pregnancy, I was miserable with it, maybe hormones and maybe diet because I also suffered from hyperemesis and couldn't eat or drink for long periods of time.

Does anyone else have eczema in the ear canals? This is a really yucky problem that creates a situation that is ripe for swimmers' ear, even if you don't swim. I use ear plugs whenever I shower, but I still get it. Unfortunately, many of the preparations that you might use for swimmers' ear are not appropriate because they are so drying.

Sounds like a very rough time. I'm sorry. As I mentioned, I have three daughters and puberty is something that looms not very far ahead for my 11-year old. I hope that things will improve for her, but we'll have to see. 

Children can be very cruel. This summer, while at camp, she had a girl ridicule her because her face was flaking and she had flare-ups on her arms and legs. It was very hurtful to her. Unfortunately, the camp director did not have the presence of mind to get her to a doctor or call me because it was worse than it had ever been and unresponsive to her medication; she really suffered with it, unnecessarily. We'll be finding another camp next year (if she wants to go).

We also tried Nursoy as a formula for our children to try to avoid allergies and eczema. I nursed all three of them until they were nearly two years old. Early on with our first, our pediatrician advised me to refrain from consuming dairy products because they might adversely affect my daughter when they passed in my milk.

None of my children would drink Nursoy (or any other formula); primarily the reason that I nursed for so long. Good luck.

Don't you object to the smell of Bag Balm? I have tried it on my hands, but my husband and kids can't stand the way it smells?

It doesn't bother me....somewhat of a "medicinal" smell, but nothing overpowering. The perfumes some of my office coworkers pour on themselves bother me more...

I think that the deterioration in Esme's condition was most likely caused by the withdrawal of conventional treatment. I don't think that homeopathy did any actual harm.

I'm unhappy about using steroid creams - especially on Esme's face - but it seems to be the only treatment we've found that is any use at all and without steroid creams Esme's condition is so bad that her life is a misery. She would be covered from head to foot with infected eczema and be completely exhausted and miserable.

I do find wet wraps very useful as it does seem to mean that lower steroid strengths are more effective. The only down side (apart from the fact that it is time consuming) is that the eczema on Esme's face has become worse. Psychologically this seems to affect her less than eczema on her limbs because she can't see the eczema herself so easily. She is 8 and as she gets older she will become more aware of the skin on her face no doubt.

I hope that puberty has a good effect on her skin.

Yes, I have eczema in my ear canals. Dried skin builds up there similar to ear wax in a normal ear. (I was told that I have no ear wax because I scratched out the wax glands). At its worst the eczema there got badly infected and spread to the ear drums. At that particular time the rest of my skin was in good shape, but I spent so much time digging in my ears that my life wasn't normal. The buzz from the scratching was the heaviest I have ever felt anywhere. When I banished QTips forever from my house, the ear canal eczema got a lot better; I was afraid I was going to lose my hearing. 

I found that mineral oil had the most unpleasant texture. I discovered that the good massage oils had Sesame, apricot and other oils. I found that those cooking oils worked much better. They are thinner and don't leave a scummy feel.

After a while, I started adding vitamin E oil to a pint of sesame oil. Doesn't cure eczema , but does cut down on dryness. If used on damp skin after bathing, it disappears into the skin very quickly. This is a big plus as silk blouses are my favorite.

I used castor oil for a good year. My skin was so sensitive that seed oils made me itch, but castor oil didn't both it. It is thick and sticky, so had to either wait for it to soak in, or wear only certain clothes after I'd applied it.

Christopher: on 18 June you said you were on 40mg a day of Prednisolone. Just wondered whether you managed to taper off or if not, what happened. I have been luckier than you and am now down to 7.5mg day with no sign of eczema returning. My derm said I should take up Chinese herbal treatment if the scratch were to return - I shall know in a few weeks' time. 

I have had eczema attacking my hands since last December (severely since April). I've been to a couple of different doctors and have used the following treatments: Elcon, Diprolene cream and ointment .05%, Bactroban, a shot in the arm of some sort, and most currently Temovate E (along with lots of moisturizer). 

I'm getting discouraged. Is there anyone out there that is seeing a Chinese herbalist or other form of non-western medicine? Also, I would like to know if any of the women out there have noticed that their flare-ups are related to their menstrual cycles. Mine seems to get worse when other PMS symptoms appear and ease up ever so slightly after my period. Is there any help for this?

I am surprised that a pediatrician would put such a little one on benadryl. Obviously, it can make children very sleepy. This is good, if sleeping is a problem, but if it isn't, you get a little kid with no energy.

My kids have used various cortisone prescriptions since they were very young. They don't always work, but for the littlest two, they usually clear up the eczema until the next outbreak.

You may want to switch him to Dove soap-fragrance free or Cetaphil. Cotton clothes seem to help, as well.

When my eczema first started flaring, it would get bad before my period, then improve greatly during and after my period. Then it switched completely, and was bad during and after my period, easing up as the month went on. Now that my condition has stabalized from using Chinese herbs, I don't notice any fluctuation.

Hey gals, another menstrual mention. My cramping lessened during this whole bout with eczema. My theory is that the Evening Primrose oil and other supplements I've been taking along with my improved diet has also helped my cramps.

Guys, keep this in mind in case you come back next time as a gal who gets cramps. Have a good weekend all.

Here's what I do to lubricate my skin. It works and creates a pleasant feeling.

Shower. Do not towel off the water. Put a little vaseline on your hands and massage them together. Put a little more Vaseline on your hands and pat the area of wet skin you want to lubricate, then gently massage the area. Dry yourself off with a towel.

Speaking of towels: I have found that 1/2 a towel is more than enough and will cut your laundry considerably especially if you use a clean towel for every shower. So don't buy any more bath towels. Those big things are not necessary.

Oil drips all over the place for me. Vaseline stays in place.

But, if you developed a non-smelly oil recipe for the skin, let us know. Doesn't vegetable oil on the skin get rancid?

AND........... I still think............that the skin must be cleaned first, before adding a lubricant, or you are increasing the chances for infection especially if you scratch.

Another Point. ..... A build up of oil or vaseline might cause fungus to grow. It is evident when you get a tan, and white spots appear on your skin. Allowing the skin to dry a bit (no oil for a while) may allow the fungus to subside. Take vitamin b complex also. To prevent this oil build up, apply the oil or vaseline AFTER you shower.

Showering with cool or cold water will minimize skin drying. especially if you use no soap. no soap no soap. Unless necessary. If you walk sockless or barefoot or have an activity that makes you dirty use some soap.

For scalp, a tar and/or aspirin solution helps. I can recommend two if you like. I have posted it here before.

For ears, drying with a twisted 2 inch piece of tissue or paper towel is helpul, as it cannot put pressure on the ear drum, can be left in the canal for a minute to absorb the water and then removed easily, leaving ears dry and UNprone to fungus infection. Before inserting, tear the end off the insertion part. This will expose more paper fibers for faster absorption of the water in the ears. I know. Put nothing in your ears... they say. But if I don't do this I get problems.

I just wanted to mention that I once used Eucerin but I have begun using Vanicream to moisturize, which is free of perfume, lanolin, dyes, formaldehyde and parabens. It's really non-greasy and I just love it. It's very soothing and soaks in much better than anything else. I'd definitely recommend it.

Copyright of the individual messages rests with those who posted them. This Archive was edited and coded for on-line publication on the Web by Byte Ryte bv.